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 3SGZE - How To

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Celica_XR9145
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PostSubject: 3SGZE - How To   Thu Oct 29, 2009 2:35 pm

This is something i plan to do in the future and that is to supercharge my 3SGE '3SGZE.'

I know that 3SPower also wants to do this so maybe he can help with this write up.

First of all,

Reliability.

If you want something reliable and can handle forced induction on stock internals, start off with a 3SGTE. Reason being that you can sell the turbo and what not to pay for the SC. Also, due to the lower compression of the 3SGTE, the stock internals can handle the forced induction and you can go up to 300bhp without worrying about injectors, internals, etc.

If you cant source down a 3SGTE, not to worry, you can still supercharge your 3SGE (what i will be doing). On stock internals, i wouldnt go over 5-6 PSI due to the high compression of the 3SGE. With forged internals, you'll be able to handle a lot more.

Performance

Obviously, if your wanting huge numbers then go for the 3SGTE and stick with the turbo. If you want an everyday fast daily driver, the SC is the better route due to having decent low-mid end power/torque.

If your going down the 3SGTE route and replacing the turbo with an SC, you'll still get big numbers but not as much as a SC 3SGE due to the lower compression. Teh again, this is a matter of opinion.

If your SC your 3SGE, you'll get better performance than the GTE SC route because you'll be starting off with a high compression engine (matter of opinion). But, because of this, you are sacraficing reliability.

What's Needed

If you SC your 3SGE and wanting to run over 5 PSI, i'd recommend upgrading internals too something far stronger. Although the GE share the rods and crank as the GTE, the GE has high compression and with F/I, you'll destroy the internals. 3SGTE rods and crank can withstand a lot of power but the standard high compression 3SGE pistons will not. It is possible to use standard 2JZ-GE pistons. These have the same compression ratio as the 3SGE (10:1) and can withstand a lot of power. These should fit straight in (Same bore and stroke, should be the same pin type aswell and he top of the piston should be the same). More of that here:

http://nacelicas.darkbb.com/general-celica-tech-f19/2jz-pistons-interchangable-with-3sge-gte-t169.htm

If your going for a roots type SC, your main power increase will be from low to mid range power so your standard N/A injectors should be up to the job but i'd play it safe and get some turbo ones from the 3SGTE.

Another thing is the replace the 3SGE loom with a MAP (?) sensored 3SGTE loom and ECU. This is so the ECU will recognise boost and will not go into limp mode. Another option is to go for an aftermarket ECU. This is to prevent engine detonation.

An essentail is a decent water to air intercooler with water injection. You'll want to mount this where you can get lots of cold air. This means custom piping.

What supercharger to use

I'd recommend using an roots tyoe SC14 off a 1GGZE. Being a roots type with give it superb low end torque with great drivability.

Second option is to use an SC12. This isnt very recommended for a high revving 2.0L but it has been used before.


Where to mount the SC

What i want to do is mount it so it can run off the alternators pulley. Reason being is that i have a massive amount of space next to my alternator. Although, your car might not have this space.

Another option is to remove the AC and run the SC there.

Both of these options you'll need custom work done.

Its easy just to slap on a SC to a 3SGE but the most important thing is the tune, this HAS to be correct!

Dont forget, Do it once, do it right!

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Last edited by Celica_XR9145 on Tue Nov 03, 2009 1:19 pm; edited 3 times in total
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PostSubject: Re: 3SGZE - How To   Fri Oct 30, 2009 7:37 am

Awesome right up mate!

This is basically what i'll be doing. I'll be rebuilding the whole engine, lightweight flywheel, lightweight pulleys, bored and ported, stronger internals, etc with an aftermarket ecu.

Problem is with mods like this, you'll always run into tiny little unexpected problems Sad


Last edited by 3Spower on Fri Oct 30, 2009 7:39 am; edited 1 time in total
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PostSubject: Re: 3SGZE - How To   Fri Oct 30, 2009 7:39 am

Quote :
Although the GE share the rods, crank and pistons as the GTE

Just one thing, the GTE pistons aren't the same as GE pistons, GTE ones are lower comp pistons where as the GE ones are high comp pistons.
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PostSubject: Re: 3SGZE - How To   Fri Oct 30, 2009 11:11 am

nice write up bro, gives me inspiration!!!!
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PostSubject: Re: 3SGZE - How To   Fri Oct 30, 2009 2:38 pm

If you want stronger pistons with the same compression ratio (10:1) depending on what gen 3S you have. use some 2JZ-GE (non-turbo) pistons.

http://nacelicas.darkbb.com/general-celica-tech-f19/2jz-pistons-interchangable-with-3sge-gte-t169.htm

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PostSubject: Re: 3SGZE - How To   Fri Oct 30, 2009 2:40 pm

3Spower wrote:
Awesome right up mate!

This is basically what i'll be doing. I'll be rebuilding the whole engine, lightweight flywheel, lightweight pulleys, bored and ported, stronger internals, etc with an aftermarket ecu.

Problem is with mods like this, you'll always run into tiny little unexpected problems Sad

Always the way, wouldn't be fun otherwise jocolor

Cool to hear i'm not the only one thinking of this then Cool

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PostSubject: Re: 3SGZE - How To   Sat Oct 31, 2009 12:22 pm

Yea, has been in my mind for a long time.

So ideally, you can do all of this and if you change your mind and wan't a turbo, you can replace the SC with a turbo and won't have to worry about internals Very Happy
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PostSubject: Re: 3SGZE - How To   Sat Oct 31, 2009 12:49 pm

3Spower wrote:
Yea, has been in my mind for a long time.

So ideally, you can do all of this and if you change your mind and wan't a turbo, you can replace the SC with a turbo and won't have to worry about internals Very Happy

You could but i would want to lower the compression first just to play i safe

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PostSubject: Re: 3SGZE - How To   Mon Nov 02, 2009 1:23 pm

problem is with celicas is that there isnt much room for an sc, i think to run it off the alternator pulley, you would need to move the power steering resovoir.
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PostSubject: Re: 3SGZE - How To   Tue Nov 03, 2009 1:12 pm

rollaboy wrote:
problem is with celicas is that there isnt much room for an sc, i think to run it off the alternator pulley, you would need to move the power steering resovoir.

Might have to yes, i shall have to dig up a link about a 3SGZE ST202 celica and he ran his SC off the alternator with room to spare Shocked

Another option is to remove the air con and mount it there.

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PostSubject: Re: 3SGZE - How To   Tue Nov 03, 2009 1:13 pm

Another problem is that on some celicas, there is something next to the alternator, possibly something to do with the ABS, not sure Neutral

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PostSubject: Re: 3SGZE - How To   Wed Nov 04, 2009 6:08 am

Celica_XR9145 wrote:
Another problem is that on some celicas, there is something next to the alternator, possibly something to do with the ABS, not sure Neutral

There is an MR2 with a gen 2 3SGE that lives by me thats supercharged, i had a chat with him and he says he has mounted where the air con used to be, he is running 6 PSI on standard internals Shocked

When he drives pass my house everyday, it sounds like a jet Twisted Evil
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PostSubject: Re: 3SGZE - How To   Thu Nov 05, 2009 1:28 pm

3Spower wrote:
Celica_XR9145 wrote:
Another problem is that on some celicas, there is something next to the alternator, possibly something to do with the ABS, not sure Neutral

There is an MR2 with a gen 2 3SGE that lives by me thats supercharged, i had a chat with him and he says he has mounted where the air con used to be, he is running 6 PSI on standard internals Shocked

When he drives pass my house everyday, it sounds like a jet Twisted Evil

Can't beat a sound of a supercharger at 7000rpm Twisted Evil Twisted Evil

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PostSubject: Re: 3SGZE - How To   Fri Nov 06, 2009 2:13 pm

Celica_XR9145 wrote:
3Spower wrote:
Celica_XR9145 wrote:
Another problem is that on some celicas, there is something next to the alternator, possibly something to do with the ABS, not sure Neutral

There is an MR2 with a gen 2 3SGE that lives by me thats supercharged, i had a chat with him and he says he has mounted where the air con used to be, he is running 6 PSI on standard internals Shocked

When he drives pass my house everyday, it sounds like a jet Twisted Evil

Can't beat a sound of a supercharger at 7000rpm Twisted Evil Twisted Evil

how about turbocharged and supercharged Twisted Evil
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